Hey Ross! Product Suggestions!

ThePatriot wrote:I never claimed to be anything other then what I am. I do not have two sets of rules like mordheim does when it comes to people who actually contributed to the site and the admins. It's perfectly fine for admins to violate the forum rules while it's not fine for anyone else. I'm not going to name names, but there were several admins on DR that violated the rules in regards to me and got a slap on the back instead of a ban as mandated by the rules.

*Sigh*

Serious ally, life is unfair. It always has been, always will be. You just have to get used to it. On the one hand, you can do what you have been doing, coming off (IMO) like a child. On the other, you can raise your head above it, and be the better person, laugh off insults, turn the other cheek, keep your own behaviour in check, and that’s all that matters.

That’s all I'm going to say in a thread for this subject (for some reason this doesn't seem right to me... may rephrase it later if I can be bothered [so no.

]) so PM me or get my msn.

To the topic!

Adeptus Astartes: Personally, I find playing a god takes quite a bit of fun out of things, but some people may like them, and, with a bit of work, I suppose that there could be a few games that work really well for them. But overall, it’s just not my kettle of fish

Cults and Cabals: From what I've heard (precious little) there is that sort of thing in DotDG, so just wait for that, as difficult as it can be

Alien Creatures: GM kit, there is a xenos generator, although a sourcebook would be quite nice, not sure how useful I would find it, but others may.

Ok, that’s all I can be bothered to look over and think about... Now to spell check this thing!

Good god is it too much to ask to stay vaguely on topic? Please, take your arguments to another thread or forum or something.

Meh, sorry anyway... Official rules for Astartes would be useful although its not too difficult to extrapolate from IH roughly what kind of stats their gear would have and there is the supplement that you can get over on dark reighn (although i dont reckon that power armour should ever go above ap9 myself, looking at the way the armour values seem to be scaled at least.) So I think Xeno rules would be better at the moment.

As much as I would like to see official rules for the big name xenos I'd actually be more interested in the lesser known (or completely new would be nice too) races. I just feel it suits the tone of DH better. Not only that but DH is a brilliant oppurtunity to put things into the game that you just cant have on the tabletop for various reasons and so I think it would be a waste to focus so heavily on eldar or tyranids or something.

Personally I'd like to see a source book about the Eastern side of the galaxy. Using a system on the fringe of Tau space as the setting would be a cool touch in my own opinion. As a setting it would be less about Chaos and cults and more about Xeno activity it does seem like all the cool Xeno based stuff is happening on the eastern side whereas Chaos seems to lurk on the western side (where the Calixis sector is based)

BPRDagent wrote:Personally I'd like to see a source book about the Eastern side of the galaxy. Using a system on the fringe of Tau space as the setting would be a cool touch in my own opinion. As a setting it would be less about Chaos and cults and more about Xeno activity it does seem like all the cool Xeno based stuff is happening on the eastern side whereas Chaos seems to lurk on the western side (where the Calixis sector is based)

Well there was (is?) supposed to be a sourcebook dealing with the Deathwatch (which would presumably also focus on xeno inquisitors) and there main base is way over on the eastern fringe so you might eventually get what you want.

ThePatriot - you are petty and disruptive on every single forum you're on. The problem is you.

I do, however, very much enjoy the supplement you helped create, so, thank you for that.

I would really like to see a book about PLACES in the Calixis sector. I'd love to see Scintilla and Gunmetal City fleshed out. Also, what about Dusk and Volg? Those are some pretty interesting sounding places for which there are only a few paragraphs of information.

Not really interested in Xeno supplements. Maybe some kind of ENEMIES OF THE IMPERIUM supplement detailing their stats as monsters and enemies. But personally I don't think playing as Xenos is within the scope of the game. It sounds like Disciples of the Dark Gods will cover a lot of ground with enemies, though.

An Astartes supplement would be great. I think players would love to play as either a small Deathwatch Killteam or as Grey Knights.

Xenocidal Maniac wrote:ThePatriot - you are petty and disruptive on every single forum you're on. The problem is you.

I do, however, very much enjoy the supplement you helped create, so, thank you for that.

I would really like to see a book about PLACES in the Calixis sector. I'd love to see Scintilla and Gunmetal City fleshed out. Also, what about Dusk and Volg? Those are some pretty interesting sounding places for which there are only a few paragraphs of information.

Not really interested in Xeno supplements. Maybe some kind of ENEMIES OF THE IMPERIUM supplement detailing their stats as monsters and enemies. But personally I don't think playing as Xenos is within the scope of the game. It sounds like Disciples of the Dark Gods will cover a lot of ground with enemies, though.

An Astartes supplement would be great. I think players would love to play as either a small Deathwatch Killteam or as Grey Knights.

I'm rather sorry that I asked the question now, but I really was unaware of what the issue was. Still, after seeing the messages shared here and elsewhere I think I understand the issue well enough now...

Anyway, as for future products one thing in general I'd like to see kept up is the split between crunch and fluff. I like how things have been so far; there are fairly detailed backgrounds, explanations and entire pages dedicated to RPing all inclusive in the same book full of rules. I like it and enjoy it a lot and it's a happy change of pace from the D&D stuff I'd gotten used to in recent years. I.E., here have some rules, and more rules, and some extra rules, many of these rules also have glaring defects, enjoy. Rules are all well and good, but when I'm buying a setting specific book I want to see equal dedication to the setting's fluff as well as the setting's rules. Just my 2 coppers/demi-thrones on that.

As for future book content, I'm not big on playing (or honestly GMing) Astartes, though some more rules on them would be nice. In a player environment however they seem too limiting and also high-powered, which is not the feel of DH in general. Give me normal people doing extraordinary things any day as compared to extraordinary people doing extraordinary things which are by proxy normal to them. It makes it all less special. Stuff like that falls more into the D&D standard fair, let's be nigh-invincible super heroes of the appropriate genre. Which is fun, but not for me or this setting IMHO. Though I certainly can see people who think otherwise. Still a Space Marine one off might have merit, and if they ever do an Astartes supplement I'll certainly judge it on its content, and hell I may even like it a lot.

What I would like to see is the addition of additional background origin and class options that fit in with the 40K trope. Definitely more Xenos, popular ones (Tau, Eldar and Orks specifically) and new & obscure ones as well. Maybe even some rudimentary playable info for each, especially the Tau as I see them as the most playable Xenos. I really would like more equipment info, but not weapons, especially if they're not balanced well as there are a few glaring examples of far superior weapons in the IH. Nothing new should obsolete old stuff, power creep is the bane that makes me stop buying books because I can screw my game up perfectly well without paying someone else to do it. But yeah, more Imperium and Xenos items/vehicles/equipment, with no emphasis on new weapons and armor, what we have now is good enough, though I'd certainly appreciate some more detailed Xenos weapons and armor.

Last I can think of at the moment is more published adventures. As someone who has hated published adventures a lot in the past, I like these and their stories and I'd certainly be interested in running more well made adventure paths.

That's it for now and hopefully I brought things somewhat back on track

Neconilis not your fault

To answer the question I for one do not really want to turn DH into the equivalent of the tabletop with factions and the like. The game I feel can either be focused and work within the constraints of what we have now or become just a basic set of rules. The problem with a very open system is the sales of a certain book will only appeal to a certain faction. Now in WH40K that is fine but for a RPG to work they must get very good sales of each book.

My preferred option would be a foes book which has something about the races which if people want to could be expanded by house rules into say a elder campaign rather than Handbook Elder. After all that was a pain in D&D and in that a mixed group was expected unlike DH where a mixed group would be at best problematic.

mordheim wrote:What is the difference between Dark Heresy's and Abnett's version of novice Acolytes and Cadet-Commisars?

They're not Acolytes. Novice Inquisitors and Cadet-Commisars are essentially rank 1 characters with actual room to grow in the field.

Hum? Whilst that might be true for Cadet-Commissars (I guess they're sent to the academy right after having finished Schola Progenum, similar to Novice Sisters), I always thought that Novice Inquisitors are recruited from the ranks of Acolytes (doesn't it say so in the fluff?) - which certainly isn't done at level 1, but when the individual has proven himself through years of loyal service in the eyes of his patron Inquisitor.

Xenocidal Maniac wrote:ThePatriot - you are petty and disruptive on every single forum you're on. The problem is you.

Oh so it's my responsibility that DR admins insulted me and violated their rules. Yep you got me on that one since I held a gun to their head and made them break their rules then ignore their own policy regarding disruptive people. Yup that's all me.

The only person I'm responsible for is myself and my own actions. I do not insult people nor do I violate rules. I also don't have a double standard nor do I profit off of someone else's work then crap all over them. I believe you're confusing me for mordheim and the not so fine admins over on DR. I'm the messenger regarding their practices which I was party to on the receiving end of it.

Xenocidal Maniac wrote:I do, however, very much enjoy the supplement you helped create, so, thank you for that.

Glad you enjoyed the supplement that was started by me and helped by a great team of talented individuals.

I would like to see three books in the near future

Ordo Xenos, Ordo Hereticus, Ordo Malleus

Each book should include guides on how to run an Inquisitorial game based on each of the Ordo's as well as a bestiary on the threats faced by the individual groups (Various aliens in the Xenos books, a selection of Demonic entities in the Malleus) specialty equipment unique to each division. Maybe also include a sample adventure and a couple of complete Campaign ideas for GM's to flesh out with their own material. (Such as a Tyrant Star Campaign for the Hereticus book) and other such information.

- Raith

Too many at once - I still stand by my points regarding the "codices approach" and the long waiting time between the books. But I would actually very much like to see this in a single supplement! It fits the game's setting perfectly (as it deals with the Inquisition, of whom the player characters are a part of) and would certainly provide a lot of useful information for players and gamemasters alike.

But I am biased.

Of course I'd also hope for a section dealing with the Adepta Sororitas here - maybe including a few more hints regarding their mysterious secret alliance with the Ordo Hereticus, whose semi-inofficial chamber militant they are forming.

Jephkay wrote:Xenology Sourcebook...

I can definitely see the desire for that, even if I personally really dislike that particular example of BL... literature. I guess I would counter that by wanting specific supplements for each of the major races, ones that also looked into the cultures as well as the Career Paths that might be crafted them. Thus more books, perhaps shorter, rather than one uber Xenology-esque approach. (Even though shorter, it could still be more in depth, which probably says much about the state of the 'fluff' on the alien races.

)

Oh, as I read on I see that you also went for the supplement-based approach to at least some of the alien races. Kewl.

Jephkay wrote:Adeptus Astartes

Even though I can see the pros and cons of having these as NPCs, I would definitely love to see a new approach to these. Few of the online versions seem to cut the mustard, at least for me, but I really don't want to go down that particular route of... discussion, other than to say that the fan versions definitely show that an official product would have to pull out a few more stops... But 'nuff said.

Jephkay wrote:Battlefleet Calixis

As a terrible gear-head, or at least gear-head wannabee, I would much rather see some example ships, blue-prints, art of rooms, etc. This, however, would tend to put it in the realm of Black Library, but - hell! - we can hope!

Jephkay wrote:Citizens of the Imperium

Definitely something that would be interesting to see.

As to other settings - in terms of both alternate historical/future settings (ala the Traveller milieu perhaps?) and different sectors? - that is also something that I would definitely like to see.

Hmmn... What else? Perhaps a few more guidelines to crossovers between the various genre, rather than pretty much keeping things to the Cthulu/dark medieval fantasy approach. Perhaps more adventure seed aspected but... Ah well, just a random, half-formed thought.

Kage

Raith wrote:I would like to see three books in the near future

Ordo Xenos, Ordo Hereticus, Ordo Malleus

Each book should include guides on how to run an Inquisitorial game based on each of the Ordo's as well as a bestiary on the threats faced by the individual groups (Various aliens in the Xenos books, a selection of Demonic entities in the Malleus) specialty equipment unique to each division. Maybe also include a sample adventure and a couple of complete Campaign ideas for GM's to flesh out with their own material. (Such as a Tyrant Star Campaign for the Hereticus book) and other such information.

- Raith

I really like that idea, and it works from a marketing standpoint as well. Definitely consider it seconded.

Sounds very much like the ideas presented for an "Adventure Anthology" described and being developed elsewhere... So cool enough.

Kage

Lynata wrote:Hum? Whilst that might be true for Cadet-Commissars (I guess they're sent to the academy right after having finished Schola Progenum, similar to Novice Sisters), I always thought that Novice Inquisitors are recruited from the ranks of Acolytes (doesn't it say so in the fluff?) - which certainly isn't done at level 1, but when the individual has proven himself through years of loyal service in the eyes of his patron Inquisitor.

From Eisenhorn: Heldane (iirc) and the brownnoser that followed Eisenhorn were both Inquisitors and came off as extremely naive for characters that started as experienced acolytes. Then there's Ravenor's circumstances as well who really did not have a past prior to being a Novice Inquisitor.

It's true that some characters become Interrogators then jump to Inquisitor, but I think Abnett pushed novices without the experience. Of course that's the fiction and that does tend to be different than the gamer stuff.

It also doesn't really make sense. Having completely inexperienced junior commissars is alright (who's going to miss one or two Guardsmen?), but completely inexperienced Inquisitors aren't really something I'd entrust with a carte-blanche-Rosette or even an Exterminatus passcode.

Hm, there are nice ideas about sourcebooks, but in my opinion FFG could also continue in Apocrypha series. New, original and yet uncovered stuff can come with sourcebooks but I´d love to see expansions for things, which are published in books. First two volumes which come on my mind are simple new possiblities for character creation:

possible vol. 2/ New Unique World of (not only) Calixis Sector AND Backround Packages:

From the postvoider savages of Faldon Kise, ritualistic murderers of Fervious and inhabitans of Misceroid to the untrustworthy Malfians, (even on Schola Progenium standards) harshly educated Progena on Macabeus Quintus or specificaly mind-cleansed, geneticaly recreated and worse, servants of Inquisition, there are plently of origins which should be covered with their own rules. Expanded backround "starters" for all careers (inclouding Soritas) are also warmly welcomed (they become very popular amongst my gaming group and I also love them, becouse they give lot of character and roleplay opportunities even to the "flat" PC )

possible vol.3/Alternative Career Ranks AND Elite Advances

Yeap, pages with alternative ranks convince me to start gaming in Calixis Sector and every player (or inspiration finding GM) is happy to have new opportunities in advance... No idea on calixis-specified ranks yet, but I´d like to see many "general 40k" stereotypes: Sister Repentia, Inquisiton Stormtrooper, Inquisiton Ward, Astropath, Cultist (yes as rank!), Skiitari-Provost (if you look into the IH, you see that there are no FW arbites..), Crusader and many many others. Oh and Elite Advances.. I realy want to use Obliterator Virus...

DoDG bring us many new opportunities to expand in Apocrypha, investigation and also crafting are other adepts for expansion and there are so many possibilities which I don´t remeber now, so FFG be so kind and bring Dark Heresy Apocrypha to life

Would LOVE to see Adeptus Mechanicus source book including muchos organisational structure and more career varients as routes for tradeskills are limited.

something with loads of info on the church and the adeptus in general.

and guns lots of shiny big guns please + WMDs

That would, indeed, be an interesting sourcebook... Well, if it did to the Adeptus Mechanicus what the (good bits) of Inqusiitor did to the Inquisition.

Kage

The problem is we need general supplements not specialist ones.

In WH40K specialist supplements work because it is all about buying minis, DH does not have that so each supplement must make money on its own back and the only way for that to happen is with general stuff.

We the fans can create all the specialist stuff we want (and to a very high quality if previous work is anything to go by) but FFG must keep it general and useful or the line will die. Specialist does not sell in the numbers required for a commercial product. It could work if DH allowed happy joint groups but as we know the 40K universe is not like that.

The Ordos book is a good idea but it needs to be one book so everyone buys it not just the ordos you are playing. Oh and a RPG of the wargame really would not work as it would be far to limited and specalist also fairley pointless as we have the wargame.

If you have a higher rate of quality, but smaller, supplements isn't that more flexible - keeping the product line putting along - than the uber ones? Is the market wanting huge books, or more smaller, focused ones?

I know that when it comes to purchasing RP books, I'll tend to go for the smaller, focused ones since it decreases the chance that I'm going to be hugely disappointed with the product. (I was one of the ones that would have loved a "complete" set of rules for 40k RPG with more "thematic" products that spall off of it, so take all with a pinch of preferential salt.)

Kage

While I'm guilty of being one of those folks that just BUYS EVERYTHING, I can see the economy of larger, general 356pg supplements in the $50 range as opposed to a blue million 128 pg $29 ones.

I'm buying all of it anyway, so what do I care?

Kage2020 wrote:If you have a higher rate of quality, but smaller, supplements isn't that more flexible - keeping the product line putting along - than the uber ones? Is the market wanting huge books, or more smaller, focused ones?

I know that when it comes to purchasing RP books, I'll tend to go for the smaller, focused ones since it decreases the chance that I'm going to be hugely disappointed with the product. (I was one of the ones that would have loved a "complete" set of rules for 40k RPG with more "thematic" products that spall off of it, so take all with a pinch of preferential salt.)

Kage

While better for the players it is not for the line, OK take a 100 fan boys 40 love Space Marines, 40 love the imperial guard, 20 love both.

2 options for publishing

a) 2 books at 25 each detailing individual. the both and the fan group buy the book 60x25 x 2books= 3000.

b) one book for 50 (20% do not buy as too expensive) 80x50 = 4000.

Simplistic I know but is fairly consistant how RPG sales go, specialist stuff is less cost effective. Some like a Space Marine supplement may work due to a uneven fan base but this just makes the other specialist books less viable.

Now I would love a individual specialist book on each and like Jephkay would buy them all but for the game it is not as viable and is why I think the fan stuff is so important.

Hmmm. I think I'm the only one who would rather see a somewhat more restrained publishing schedule. I can't think of a worse tactic than to produce "Codex"-style books on each and every faction (Ordo Hereticus? Ordo Malleus? Officio Assassinorum?) operating in Calixis. It would quickly spiral out of control in terms of production costs, and with each new release you'd give diehard fans one more reason to work themselves into a froth for misidentifying a power armor pattern or a boltgun shell.

Rather, I'd like to see themed books (several forumites have mentioned this) dedicated to particular sub-sectors, planets, or flashpoints. I could see the setting producing 4 or 5 such books.